Webcam as IR finder

[Wiegraebe, Winfried-2]

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Does someone has experience with using a cheap night vision wireless security web cam as IR
finder? I want to align our NIR lasers and OPO at our two-photon microscopes. A wavelength
range from 700nm to 1300 should be sufficient.
Thanks,
Winfried

Winfried Wiegraebe
Head of Microscopy
Stowers Institute for Medical Research

[hidden email]
[phone]
http://research.stowers.org/microscopy/
http://www.stowers.org/

[samjlord]

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On Wed, 17 Sep 2014 11:56:21 -0500, Winfried Wiegraebe
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>Does someone has experience with using a cheap night vision wireless security
web cam as IR
>finder?

I've seen this done before with a normal cheap webcam, after removing the IR
filter:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Infrared-IR-Webcam/?ALLSTEPS
http://blog.everydayscientist.com/wp-content/uploads/NIST-Green-Pointer.pdf

Unfortunately, the sensitivity of a typical CMOS or CCD webcam probably won't go
out beyond something like 900 nm.

I would recommend not using a night-vision security webcam, because those work
by shining IR LEDs, which would obscure your laser beam.

-Sam

[Michael Giacomelli]

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>A wavelength range from 700nm to 1300 should be sufficient.

Typical CMOS cuts out around 950 nm.  Digital sensors above 1 um tend
to be very expensive.

A much cheaper option is a Find-R-Scope:

http://www.findrscope.com/

Mike

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 12:56 PM, Winfried Wiegraebe <[hidden email]> wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Does someone has experience with using a cheap night vision wireless security web cam as IR
> finder? I want to align our NIR lasers and OPO at our two-photon microscopes. A wavelength
> range from 700nm to 1300 should be sufficient.
> Thanks,
> Winfried
>
> Winfried Wiegraebe
> Head of Microscopy
> Stowers Institute for Medical Research
>
> [hidden email]
> [phone]
> http://research.stowers.org/microscopy/
> http://www.stowers.org/

[McKinney, Sean]

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A colleague removed an IR filter from a C910 from logitech (see below), I just measured and it can detect out to 1130nm.

http://www.alcs.ch/logitech-c910-infrared-conversion-for-nightvision.html

Sean
________________________________________
From: Confocal Microscopy List [[hidden email]] on behalf of Sam Lord [[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2014 2:11 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Webcam as IR finder

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On Wed, 17 Sep 2014 11:56:21 -0500, Winfried Wiegraebe
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>Does someone has experience with using a cheap night vision wireless security
web cam as IR
>finder?

I've seen this done before with a normal cheap webcam, after removing the IR
filter:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Infrared-IR-Webcam/?ALLSTEPS
http://blog.everydayscientist.com/wp-content/uploads/NIST-Green-Pointer.pdf

Unfortunately, the sensitivity of a typical CMOS or CCD webcam probably won't go
out beyond something like 900 nm.

I would recommend not using a night-vision security webcam, because those work
by shining IR LEDs, which would obscure your laser beam.

-Sam

[Craig Brideau]

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I have a Sony XE analog camera that I use with an OPA, and it seems to be
able to detect the beam out past 1000nm. It really depends on the strength
of your source. If you are trying to spot a laser beam on a target then it
might be bright enough for the camera to catch it even though on paper the
camera shouldn't be able to easily detect that wavelength. For the cost of
a couple cheap webcams it might be worth trying and seeing. Just make sure
to pop out the filter!

Craig Brideau

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 5:05 PM, McKinney, Sean <[hidden email]> wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> A colleague removed an IR filter from a C910 from logitech (see below), I
> just measured and it can detect out to 1130nm.
>
> http://www.alcs.ch/logitech-c910-infrared-conversion-for-nightvision.html
>
> Sean
> ________________________________________
> From: Confocal Microscopy List [[hidden email]] on
> behalf of Sam Lord [[hidden email]]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2014 2:11 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: Webcam as IR finder
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> On Wed, 17 Sep 2014 11:56:21 -0500, Winfried Wiegraebe
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >Does someone has experience with using a cheap night vision wireless
> security
> web cam as IR
> >finder?
>
> I've seen this done before with a normal cheap webcam, after removing the
> IR
> filter:
> http://www.instructables.com/id/Infrared-IR-Webcam/?ALLSTEPS
> http://blog.everydayscientist.com/wp-content/uploads/NIST-Green-Pointer.pdf
>
> Unfortunately, the sensitivity of a typical CMOS or CCD webcam probably
> won't go
> out beyond something like 900 nm.
>
> I would recommend not using a night-vision security webcam, because those
> work
> by shining IR LEDs, which would obscure your laser beam.
>
> -Sam
>

[Reto Fiolka]

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Dear list,

I have used quite a lot the Find-r-scope that Mike was referring to. If you align setups with
NIR light, it is very helpful and I can highly recommend it.

I now use the Miniature IR Viewer from Newport (http://search.newport.com/?
q=*&x2=sku&q2=IRV1-1700), together with a headband to have both hands free. It works,
but the device has a silly small battery that is drained rather quickly.

Alternatively, if your setup uses a coherent Chameleon, you can put it in alignment mode. The
Chameleon then emits in CW at a low wavelength (~700nm) that can bee seen by eye. I lately
use that for alignment purposes, albeit some of the optics may perform differently then they
would at the design NIR wavelengths.

Best,
Reto

[Craig Brideau]

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Note that the Chameleon in 'alignment mode' still produces enough power to
be an eye hazard, so you have to be careful. The thing I like about using
cameras is that you don't risk your eye at all while working!

Craig Brideau

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Reto Fiolka <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Dear list,
>
> I have used quite a lot the Find-r-scope that Mike was referring to. If
> you align setups with
> NIR light, it is very helpful and I can highly recommend it.
>
> I now use the Miniature IR Viewer from Newport (http://search.newport.com/
> ?
> q=*&x2=sku&q2=IRV1-1700), together with a headband to have both hands
> free. It works,
> but the device has a silly small battery that is drained rather quickly.
>
> Alternatively, if your setup uses a coherent Chameleon, you can put it in
> alignment mode. The
> Chameleon then emits in CW at a low wavelength (~700nm) that can bee seen
> by eye. I lately
> use that for alignment purposes, albeit some of the optics may perform
> differently then they
> would at the design NIR wavelengths.
>
> Best,
> Reto
>

[Wiegraebe, Winfried-2]

Thanks a lot for all the excellent suggestions.
We have to align the system at its specific wavelengths because we combine beams using beam splitter.

At this moment, it appears the following approach will work for us:
- Use Logitech C910 web camera and remove IR filter
- connect camera to MacBook Pro
- view image with PhotoBooth
Or use FaceTime and connect with iPad. Thus, we can leave the camera with computer at the position we want to look at, while carrying the iPad around and put in a convenient position for alignment.

With this setup, all components and visible lasers appear in their natural color.
NIR lasers look very bright. We typically shine the laser on a surface (e.g. iris, lens paper). We have to dim the lasers with AOMs to the minimum allowed by our software (ZEN from Zeiss) to avoid saturation of the image. We tried different wavelengths up to 1100nm. Even 1100 nm is very well visible; I would not be surprised if I could go higher.

Thanks for all your help,
Winfried

Winfried Wiegraebe
Head of Microscopy
Stowers Institute for Medical Research

[hidden email]
[phone]
http://research.stowers.org/microscopy/
http://www.stowers.org/

-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Craig Brideau
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:50 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Webcam as IR finder

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*****

Note that the Chameleon in 'alignment mode' still produces enough power to be an eye hazard, so you have to be careful. The thing I like about using cameras is that you don't risk your eye at all while working!

Craig Brideau

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Reto Fiolka <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Dear list,
>
> I have used quite a lot the Find-r-scope that Mike was referring to.
> If you align setups with NIR light, it is very helpful and I can
> highly recommend it.
>
> I now use the Miniature IR Viewer from Newport
> (http://search.newport.com/ ?
> q=*&x2=sku&q2=IRV1-1700), together with a headband to have both hands
> free. It works, but the device has a silly small battery that is
> drained rather quickly.
>
> Alternatively, if your setup uses a coherent Chameleon, you can put it
> in alignment mode. The Chameleon then emits in CW at a low wavelength
> (~700nm) that can bee seen by eye. I lately use that for alignment
> purposes, albeit some of the optics may perform differently then they
> would at the design NIR wavelengths.
>
> Best,
> Reto
>