XY stability of motorized stage
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Dear all,
I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is around 500 nm). This is Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires coming from the ceiling...). Christophe Leterrier |
 
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Michael Herron |
Re: XY stability of motorized stage
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As mechanical parts age they get more play in them and you will see
shifts. If it is a problem for your research you either need to get it fixed or use one of the image stabilization programs such as Image Stabilizer for ImageJ http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~kangli/code/Image_Stabilizer.html On Feb 18, 2009, at 9:47 AM, Christophe Leterrier wrote: > Dear all, > > I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI > MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph > Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and > aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half > an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron > diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron > trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). > These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is > around 500 nm). This is > > Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? > What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big > incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires > coming from the ceiling...). > > Christophe Leterrier Michael J. Herron, U of MN, Dept. of Entomology [hidden email] 612-624-3688 (office) 612-625-5299 (FAX) |
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Watkins, Simon C |
Re: XY stability of motorized stage
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In reply to this post by lechristophe
linear encoders inside humidified big boxes get dirty over time. I have multiple ASI stages and they all have been working very well for periods of up to 10 years... but get stuff on the encoders (dust, media etc) and things go haywire (I know this from clumsy experience). My advice would be to use an airgun and blow out between the encoder reader and plate. if this doesnt work send it back to ASI. They are a very responsive company and I am sure will fix the stage in very short order.
Simon Simon C. Watkins Ph.D, FRC Path Professor and Vice Chair Cell Biology and Physiology Professor Immunology Director Center for Biologic Imaging BSTS 225 University of Pittsburgh 3500 Terrace St Pittsburgh PA 15261 412-352-2277 www.cbi.pitt.edu ________________________________________ From: Confocal Microscopy List [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Christophe Leterrier [[hidden email]] Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 10:47 AM To: [hidden email] Subject: XY stability of motorized stage Dear all, I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is around 500 nm). This is Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires coming from the ceiling...). Christophe Leterrier |
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Zarda, Boris |
Antwort: XY stability of motorized stage
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In reply to this post by lechristophe
Dear Christophe,
besides looking only for the technical side: it could also be a lateral movement of the sample, depending on acceleration of the stage, eventual immersion media etc. Make sure that the sample is really WELL fixed. Just my 2 cents Boris Zarda Dr. rer nat. Field Support Manager Europe Leica Microsystems CH-9435 Heerbrugg Tel +41 44 768 36 30 Mob +41 79 609 77 45 Christophe Leterrier <christophe.leter An [hidden email]> [hidden email] Gesendet von: Kopie Confocal Microscopy List Thema <CONFOCALMICROSCO XY stability of motorized stage [hidden email]> 18.02.2009 16:47 Bitte antworten an Confocal Microscopy List <CONFOCALMICROSCO [hidden email]> Dear all, I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is around 500 nm). This is Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires coming from the ceiling...). Christophe Leterrier ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ |
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lechristophe |
Re: XY stability of motorized stage
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First, thank you all for your replies both private and on the list. As
an image is worth a thousand words, I guess a movie is even better so I uploaded a little movie that demonstrate the problem (it is a compilation of four tries, 30 minute movies, one frame every 30s, of subdiffraction beads taken with 100X 1.46 optovar 1.6, pixel size is 100nm) : ftp://ftp-jean-roche.univ-mrs.fr/pub/UMR641/christo/microscopy/XY_drift.mov Christophe -- Christophe Leterrier Postdoc INSERM UMR641 // Ionic channels Lab IFR Jean Roche, Mediterranée University Marseille, France [hidden email] On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 17:32, <[hidden email]> wrote: > Dear Christophe, > > besides looking only for the technical side: it could also be a lateral > movement of the sample, depending on acceleration of the stage, eventual > immersion media etc. Make sure that the sample is really WELL fixed. > > Just my 2 cents > > Boris Zarda > Dr. rer nat. > Field Support Manager Europe > Leica Microsystems > CH-9435 Heerbrugg > Tel +41 44 768 36 30 > Mob +41 79 609 77 45 > > > > > > > Christophe > Leterrier > <christophe.leter An > [hidden email]> [hidden email] > Gesendet von: Kopie > Confocal > Microscopy List Thema > <CONFOCALMICROSCO XY stability of motorized stage > [hidden email]> > > > 18.02.2009 16:47 > > > Bitte antworten > an > Confocal > Microscopy List > <CONFOCALMICROSCO > [hidden email]> > > > > > > Dear all, > > I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI > MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph > Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and > aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half > an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron > diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron > trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). > These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is > around 500 nm). This is > > Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? > What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big > incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires > coming from the ceiling...). > > Christophe Leterrier > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > |
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Beat Ludin |
Re: XY stability of motorized stage
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In reply to this post by lechristophe
Dear Christophe
Have you ever tried switching off the stage? That should at least tell you whether the stage is moving actively (in which case the linear encoders are most likely to blame). Beat At 16:47 18-02-2009, you wrote: >Dear all, > >I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI >MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph >Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and >aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half >an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron >diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron >trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). >These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is >around 500 nm). This is > >Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? >What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big >incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires >coming from the ceiling...). > >Christophe Leterrier |
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Rietdorf, Jens |
Re: XY stability of motorized stage
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In reply to this post by lechristophe
Dear Christophe,
We had a very similar problem with one of our ASI stages (also using MM software, but I think that's less critical). We also had the suspicion that there was something wrong with the stability of the stage, then did lots of measurements, then got the linear encoders cleaned et voila, everything was fine again. If you want to argue, the measurement you have to do is the following: take a position on a slide with a target pattern or a pattern of beads. Program the stage to move away from the original position and come back to this position. Repeat in different directions from the origin. Calculate the root mean square: Square all re-localization differences to avoid negative values, then square root, then take the mean. At least 30 measurements was what I was told to do. Compare the value with the specs of the stage. We could not access the linear encoders for cleaning, because we had a z-piezo version of the stage, so we had to send it in for cleaning. ASI was kind enough to provide us with a replacement stage while they did the cleaning. Excellent service, though it took us a while to convince our system provider of the problem. Good luck, jens. -----Original Message----- From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Christophe Leterrier Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 16:47 PM To: [hidden email] Subject: XY stability of motorized stage Dear all, I'm concerned about the XY stability of a motorized stage. It is a ASI MS-2000, equipped with XY linear encoders, controlled by Metamorph Software. Using a 100X objective and a 1.6 magnifying lens, and aquiring at a fixed position, I can get up to 1 micron drift over half an our. That is, the amplitude of movement is inside a 1 micron diameter circle, but the test bead can have a several micron trajectory inside this circle (up to 5 or 10 microns total movement). These are the worst cases, usually I have a few pixels drift (that is around 500 nm). This is Is that stability acceptable or should I have the stage serviced ? What can be the cause of instability (I'm already inside a big incubator box, on an optics air table, with all cables and wires coming from the ceiling...). Christophe Leterrier |
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