Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

[Moulding, Dale]

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I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is
it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is
British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a
small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8
processor cores).
I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
thanks all,
Dale

[Sebastian Munck]

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I am quoted 400€ more.
Best Seb
________________________________________
Von: Confocal Microscopy List [[hidden email]]" im Auftrag von "Dale Moulding [[hidden email]]
Gesendet: Dienstag, 18. November 2014 13:35
An: [hidden email]
Betreff: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

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*****

I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is
it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is
British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a
small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8
processor cores).
I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
thanks all,
Dale

[mark van turnhout]

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Hello,


We used to run Imaris at our lab, but we (I :-) switched to Huygens.

I obtained Huygens next to Imaris for my own project a couple of years
ago for three reasons: deconvolution, deconvolution, and it runs on
Linux (one less bloody MS-machine to maintain, apart from the other
advantages that Linux has).

The feeling I got back then about Imaris was that is was a nice program
to make fancy images, but that its quantitative processes remained
somewhat obscure. I like to know what the software is doing, why it is
doing that, and why it is doing that in that particular way. I had the
feeling with Imaris that you could use a e.g. slider to 'improve' the
'look' of your data, but that it was not entirely clear what that slider
actually 'did'.


Also, I needed deconvolution and both previous users at our lab and the
internet suggested Huygens for this. Deconvolution is their 'core
business' and I understand that the next generation Leica LSM software
will come with a Huygens engine for deconvolution.

Now that I'm responsible for our microscopy lab, I decided to let the
Imaris license go, and keep the license and maintenance for Huygens.
It is/may appear slightly less fancy than Imaris, but imo the pro's are

- price

- runs on Linux. Multiple users can log on to the same machine and use
the single license simultaneously. This is all supported and encouraged
by SVI.

- is scriptable. Oh, how I love that...

- support, support, and support. In my experience, the people at SVI are
very, very, helpful. More than once I asked 'can I get access to that
and that number from the scripting interface' to which the answer would
be 'well, no, those numbers are for internal use and not really
available to the end-user... but... if you try this and that...'



Now, I must confess that my experience with Imaris is actually quite
limited.
My first impression about it being mostly 'fancy' and 'less
quantitative' may be awfully wrong, and it may e.g. be as scriptable as
Huygens (I do remember that there was somekind of interface to Matlab?).

So my opinion may not even add up to the usual 'five cents'.
And if I'm wrong about Imaris, I'll be happy to learn about that!



best,
mark


On 18/11/14 13:35, Dale Moulding wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is
> it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is
> British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
> Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a
> small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8
> processor cores).
> I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
> thanks all,
> Dale
>

--
Anyone who isn't confused really doesn't understand the situation.
           -Edward R. Murrow

[Arne Seitz]

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In the facility we do have Imaris and Huygens. Until last year both were under a maintenance contract. But for this year I decided against an Imaris contract because I'm really upset with their price policy. The maintenance is way too expensive especially for that what you get in return (IMHO: just nothing). To give you an idea: the maintenance contact for 2014 was promoted with the idea of using Imaris8 from fall that year. Until now Imaris8 has not been launched yet-Bitplane just announced that it will be released soon. So to my opinion is it worth while checking what is offered and what you get.
I should point that we still do use Imaris. It is still functioning without maintenance contract (and probably will for a few more years). With the money I save, I will buy/upgrade a software for 3D rendering and analysis when it is necessary (e.g. Arivis might become a real alternative soon).

I'm very happy with our Huygens maintenance contract as I do things moving and the price is reasonable.

Best regards
Arne

--no commercial interests--
---------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Arne Seitz
Head of Bioimaging and Optics Platform (BIOP)
Swiss Institute of Technology (EPFL)
Faculty of Life Sciences
Station 15
CH-1015 Lausanne

Phone: [phone]
Fax:      [phone]
http://biop.epfl.ch/
---------------------------------------------------------------




-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dale Moulding
Sent: mardi 18 novembre 2014 13:35
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

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*****

I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8 processor cores).
I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
thanks all,
Dale

[simon walker (BI)-2]

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Hi.  We too have both Imaris and Huygens (and Volocity as it happens).  I second what Arne has said, although we just fell on the side of contract renewal this year with a view to receiving the Imaris 8 update.  It was a very tight decision as in my opinion their maintenance is getting far too expensive (although I have no complaints about the support).  Unless their prices drop significantly next year I think we are unlikely to renew.  Surely it makes more sense to have a large subscriber base paying a lower contract price than a small privileged group who can afford the high costs.  Hopefully if as a user community we raise our concerns then they will listen.
Simon
P.S. I only have positive things to say about SVI/Huygens

----------------
Imaging Facility
Babraham Research Campus
[hidden email]
http://www.babraham.ac.uk/science-services/imaging






-----Original Message-----
From: Seitz Arne [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 18 November 2014 14:28
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

*****
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In the facility we do have Imaris and Huygens. Until last year both were under a maintenance contract. But for this year I decided against an Imaris contract because I'm really upset with their price policy. The maintenance is way too expensive especially for that what you get in return (IMHO: just nothing). To give you an idea: the maintenance contact for 2014 was promoted with the idea of using Imaris8 from fall that year. Until now Imaris8 has not been launched yet-Bitplane just announced that it will be released soon. So to my opinion is it worth while checking what is offered and what you get.
I should point that we still do use Imaris. It is still functioning without maintenance contract (and probably will for a few more years). With the money I save, I will buy/upgrade a software for 3D rendering and analysis when it is necessary (e.g. Arivis might become a real alternative soon).

I'm very happy with our Huygens maintenance contract as I do things moving and the price is reasonable.

Best regards
Arne

--no commercial interests--
---------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Arne Seitz
Head of Bioimaging and Optics Platform (BIOP) Swiss Institute of Technology (EPFL) Faculty of Life Sciences Station 15
CH-1015 Lausanne

Phone: [phone]
Fax:      [phone]
http://biop.epfl.ch/
---------------------------------------------------------------




-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dale Moulding
Sent: mardi 18 novembre 2014 13:35
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

*****
To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
*****

I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8 processor cores).
I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
thanks all,
Dale
The Babraham Institute, Babraham Research Campus, Cambridge CB22 3AT Registered Charity No. 1053902.
The information transmitted in this email is directed only to the addressee. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete this email from your system. The contents of this e-mail are the views of the sender and do not necessarily represent the views of the Babraham Institute. Full conditions at: www.babraham.ac.uk<http://www.babraham.ac.uk/terms>

[Oliver Biehlmaier-2]

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Dear all,

I fully support what Arne was writing.
We have a similar situation here at the Biozentrum with usage of Imaris, Huygens, and (since last year) Arivis. We are very happy with Huygens and Arivis as they are always responsive to all our requests, their software continuously improves, and maintenance pricing is reasonable.

On the contrary, Imaris failed to react to most of our inputs and requests during the past years, did not solve problems when modules failed to work (batch module) but continue to charge horrendous maintenance fees. This is especially annoying for modules that have not been worked on for years (e.g. the colocalization module).
We received our maintenance contract for the next year recently and were shocked about the pricing (like every year). Considering the potential of other software such as FIJI, ICY, Arivis, Amira, Huygens, etc. we are also seriously considering to discontinue maintenance or at least significantly reduce it.
I want to point out that for a long time (since 2003) I was a very happy user and strong supporter of Imaris. In my time as facility staff and facility head I introduced many, many new users to the software by giving courses every 3 to 6 month. I always hoped that Bitplane would return to what they were approx. 5 years ago, when feature requests and bug reports where taken seriously and Bitplane tried to improve the software with every release. We will see what IMARIS 8 will bring…

Best regards,
Oliver


- no commercial interest -


Oliver Biehlmaier, PhD | Head of Imaging Core Facility  | Biozentrum, University of Basel | Klingelbergstrasse 50/70 | CH-4056 Basel
Phone: [phone] | Email: [hidden email] | www.biozentrum.unibas.ch | www.microscopynetwork.unibas.ch

> On 18 Nov 2014, at 16:13, Simon Walker <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Hi.  We too have both Imaris and Huygens (and Volocity as it happens).  I second what Arne has said, although we just fell on the side of contract renewal this year with a view to receiving the Imaris 8 update.  It was a very tight decision as in my opinion their maintenance is getting far too expensive (although I have no complaints about the support).  Unless their prices drop significantly next year I think we are unlikely to renew.  Surely it makes more sense to have a large subscriber base paying a lower contract price than a small privileged group who can afford the high costs.  Hopefully if as a user community we raise our concerns then they will listen.
> Simon
> P.S. I only have positive things to say about SVI/Huygens
>
> ----------------
> Imaging Facility
> Babraham Research Campus
> [hidden email]
> http://www.babraham.ac.uk/science-services/imaging
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Seitz Arne [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: 18 November 2014 14:28
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> In the facility we do have Imaris and Huygens. Until last year both were under a maintenance contract. But for this year I decided against an Imaris contract because I'm really upset with their price policy. The maintenance is way too expensive especially for that what you get in return (IMHO: just nothing). To give you an idea: the maintenance contact for 2014 was promoted with the idea of using Imaris8 from fall that year. Until now Imaris8 has not been launched yet-Bitplane just announced that it will be released soon. So to my opinion is it worth while checking what is offered and what you get.
> I should point that we still do use Imaris. It is still functioning without maintenance contract (and probably will for a few more years). With the money I save, I will buy/upgrade a software for 3D rendering and analysis when it is necessary (e.g. Arivis might become a real alternative soon).
>
> I'm very happy with our Huygens maintenance contract as I do things moving and the price is reasonable.
>
> Best regards
> Arne
>
> --no commercial interests--
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> Dr. Arne Seitz
> Head of Bioimaging and Optics Platform (BIOP) Swiss Institute of Technology (EPFL) Faculty of Life Sciences Station 15
> CH-1015 Lausanne
>
> Phone: [phone]
> Fax:      [phone]
> http://biop.epfl.ch/
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dale Moulding
> Sent: mardi 18 novembre 2014 13:35
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
> Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8 processor cores).
> I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
> thanks all,
> Dale
> The Babraham Institute, Babraham Research Campus, Cambridge CB22 3AT Registered Charity No. 1053902.
> The information transmitted in this email is directed only to the addressee. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete this email from your system. The contents of this e-mail are the views of the sender and do not necessarily represent the views of the Babraham Institute. Full conditions at: www.babraham.ac.uk<http://www.babraham.ac.uk/terms>

[Andreas Bruckbauer]

I agree £4000 is too much for a software main
*****
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*****


 

I agree £4000 is too much for a software maintenance contract. But without the option to upgrade to the newest version it is not possible to read all the new file formats which the microscope companies come up with to cater for ever new and improved methods. Does anyone know a real alternative to Imaris for 4 dimensional (3D + t) tracking of cells? We use Imaris extensively for this as one can very quickly look at the sample from different angles and play through the time points to see if the tracking works. This is very important to see cell-cell contacts. The possibility to link from Imaris to Matlab to do more complex calculations is also a benefit. Does the maintenance depend on the modules one uses?

best wishes

Andreas

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Simon Walker <[hidden email]>
To: CONFOCALMICROSCOPY <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tue, 18 Nov 2014 15:14
Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance


*****
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*****

Hi.  We too have both Imaris and Huygens (and Volocity as it happens).  I second
what Arne has said, although we just fell on the side of contract renewal this
year with a view to receiving the Imaris 8 update.  It was a very tight decision
as in my opinion their maintenance is getting far too expensive (although I have
no complaints about the support).  Unless their prices drop significantly next
year I think we are unlikely to renew.  Surely it makes more sense to have a
large subscriber base paying a lower contract price than a small privileged
group who can afford the high costs.  Hopefully if as a user community we raise
our concerns then they will listen.
Simon
P.S. I only have positive things to say about SVI/Huygens

----------------
Imaging Facility
Babraham Research Campus
[hidden email]
http://www.babraham.ac.uk/science-services/imaging






-----Original Message-----
From: Seitz Arne [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 18 November 2014 14:28
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

*****
To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
*****

In the facility we do have Imaris and Huygens. Until last year both were under a
maintenance contract. But for this year I decided against an Imaris contract
because I'm really upset with their price policy. The maintenance is way too
expensive especially for that what you get in return (IMHO: just nothing). To
give you an idea: the maintenance contact for 2014 was promoted with the idea of
using Imaris8 from fall that year. Until now Imaris8 has not been launched
yet-Bitplane just announced that it will be released soon. So to my opinion is
it worth while checking what is offered and what you get.
I should point that we still do use Imaris. It is still functioning without
maintenance contract (and probably will for a few more years). With the money I
save, I will buy/upgrade a software for 3D rendering and analysis when it is
necessary (e.g. Arivis might become a real alternative soon).

I'm very happy with our Huygens maintenance contract as I do things moving and
the price is reasonable.

Best regards
Arne

--no commercial interests--
---------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Arne Seitz
Head of Bioimaging and Optics Platform (BIOP) Swiss Institute of Technology
(EPFL) Faculty of Life Sciences Station 15
CH-1015 Lausanne

Phone: [phone]
Fax:      [phone]
http://biop.epfl.ch/
---------------------------------------------------------------




-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On
Behalf Of Dale Moulding
Sent: mardi 18 novembre 2014 13:35
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance

*****
To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
*****

I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens
software. Is it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are
extortionate! £4312 (yes that is British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much
more palatable £880 for Huygens.
Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted
£1000 for a small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a
workstation (and use all 8 processor cores).
I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with
Imaris.
thanks all,
Dale
The Babraham Institute, Babraham Research Campus, Cambridge CB22 3AT Registered
Charity No. 1053902.
The information transmitted in this email is directed only to the addressee. If
you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete this email from
your system. The contents of this e-mail are the views of the sender and do not
necessarily represent the views of the Babraham Institute. Full conditions at:
www.babraham.ac.uk<http://www.babraham.ac.uk/terms>

 

[Steffen Dietzel]

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*****

Andreas,

concerning new file formats, you may be able to solve that via the
Imaris-Fiji bridge: Load the file in Fiji, then use the "image from
Fiji" command. I believe this was introduced some time in the last two
years. I am currently running Imaris 7.6.5 an there it is included. You
will use more RAM to do that, though.

Steffen

Am 19.11.2014 10:29, schrieb Andreas Bruckbauer:

> I agree £4000 is too much for a software main
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
>
>  
>
> I agree £4000 is too much for a software maintenance contract. But without the option to upgrade to the newest version it is not possible to read all the new file formats which the microscope companies come up with to cater for ever new and improved methods. Does anyone know a real alternative to Imaris for 4 dimensional (3D + t) tracking of cells? We use Imaris extensively for this as one can very quickly look at the sample from different angles and play through the time points to see if the tracking works. This is very important to see cell-cell contacts. The possibility to link from Imaris to Matlab to do more complex calculations is also a benefit. Does the maintenance depend on the modules one uses?
>
> best wishes
>
> Andreas
>
>  
>
>  
>
>

--
------------------------------------------------------------
Steffen Dietzel, PD Dr. rer. nat
Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München
Walter-Brendel-Zentrum für experimentelle Medizin (WBex)
Head of light microscopy

Mail room:
Marchioninistr. 15, D-81377 München

Building location:
Marchioninistr. 27,  München-Großhadern

[Avi Jacob]

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*****

Hi all,

We too have both (well kinda, we only have the Huygens Elements) and I will
chime in that the Imaris subscription is high for us. So my core did not
renew this year and we are staying at version 7.7 for the foreseeable
future.

It also gave me a lot of problems with recognizing the matlab HCR on my
brand new, Imaris dedicated (Windows) machine, and I got no help from
bitplane. Thankfully, one of my kind colleagues helped me out and sent me
what I needed.

Avi




On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 4:44 PM, Steffen Dietzel <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Andreas,
>
> concerning new file formats, you may be able to solve that via the
> Imaris-Fiji bridge: Load the file in Fiji, then use the "image from
> Fiji" command. I believe this was introduced some time in the last two
> years. I am currently running Imaris 7.6.5 an there it is included. You
> will use more RAM to do that, though.
>
> Steffen
>
> Am 19.11.2014 10:29, schrieb Andreas Bruckbauer:
> > I agree £4000 is too much for a software main
> > *****
> > To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> > http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> > Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your
> posting.
> > *****
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree £4000 is too much for a software maintenance contract. But
> without the option to upgrade to the newest version it is not possible to
> read all the new file formats which the microscope companies come up with
> to cater for ever new and improved methods. Does anyone know a real
> alternative to Imaris for 4 dimensional (3D + t) tracking of cells? We use
> Imaris extensively for this as one can very quickly look at the sample from
> different angles and play through the time points to see if the tracking
> works. This is very important to see cell-cell contacts. The possibility to
> link from Imaris to Matlab to do more complex calculations is also a
> benefit. Does the maintenance depend on the modules one uses?
> >
> > best wishes
> >
> > Andreas
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> Steffen Dietzel, PD Dr. rer. nat
> Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München
> Walter-Brendel-Zentrum für experimentelle Medizin (WBex)
> Head of light microscopy
>
> Mail room:
> Marchioninistr. 15, D-81377 München
>
> Building location:
> Marchioninistr. 27,  München-Großhadern
>

[Moulding, Dale]

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Thanks for all the responses, the general feeling seems to be that Imaris is a bit too
expensive, and support isn't as good as it should be. Fortunately our current license is good
for another month, so I'll upgrade to version 8 then let the maintenance lapse. I could of
course just get maintenance for the most heavily used modules, which would be
considerable cheaper, but the consensus does seem to be that the support you get isn't
worth it. What a shame as my initial impression using the software is that it's a very useful
tool.
thanks again,
Dale

[Giovanna Expósito Romero-2]

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Dear
colleagues,


We have
Imaris in our Imaging Facility from 2007, but no experience with Huygens. During
these years with Imaris they always gave us good support respect both technical
and application support. Because of we are a poor facility, sometimes we didn´t
have money to renew the maintenance contract, and I have to say that they always
helped us, even in these situations.


I can not
compare maintenance prices between Imaris and Huygens, I think it depends on
the number of modules you have, but in my opinion Imaris price is too high… Many
of us can not afford those prices. I think both Huygens and Imaris they should
review their prices, more after these comments.


I would really
like to upgrade to Imaris 8. It seems really improved. We still don´t have
Vantage and it is quite handy. Moreover I am very curious about Huygens. We
still don´t have deconvolution software…



Best
regards,

Giovanna
Expósito

> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2014 17:50:38 +0000
> From: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance
> To: [hidden email]
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Dear all,
>
> I fully support what Arne was writing.
> We have a similar situation here at the Biozentrum with usage of Imaris, Huygens, and (since last year) Arivis. We are very happy with Huygens and Arivis as they are always responsive to all our requests, their software continuously improves, and maintenance pricing is reasonable.
>
> On the contrary, Imaris failed to react to most of our inputs and requests during the past years, did not solve problems when modules failed to work (batch module) but continue to charge horrendous maintenance fees. This is especially annoying for modules that have not been worked on for years (e.g. the colocalization module).
> We received our maintenance contract for the next year recently and were shocked about the pricing (like every year). Considering the potential of other software such as FIJI, ICY, Arivis, Amira, Huygens, etc. we are also seriously considering to discontinue maintenance or at least significantly reduce it.
> I want to point out that for a long time (since 2003) I was a very happy user and strong supporter of Imaris. In my time as facility staff and facility head I introduced many, many new users to the software by giving courses every 3 to 6 month. I always hoped that Bitplane would return to what they were approx. 5 years ago, when feature requests and bug reports where taken seriously and Bitplane tried to improve the software with every release. We will see what IMARIS 8 will bring…
>
> Best regards,
> Oliver
>
>
> - no commercial interest -
>
>
> Oliver Biehlmaier, PhD | Head of Imaging Core Facility  | Biozentrum, University of Basel | Klingelbergstrasse 50/70 | CH-4056 Basel
> Phone: [phone] | Email: [hidden email] | www.biozentrum.unibas.ch | www.microscopynetwork.unibas.ch
>
>
>
>
> > On 18 Nov 2014, at 16:13, Simon Walker <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > *****
> > To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> > http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> > Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> > *****
> >
> > Hi.  We too have both Imaris and Huygens (and Volocity as it happens).  I second what Arne has said, although we just fell on the side of contract renewal this year with a view to receiving the Imaris 8 update.  It was a very tight decision as in my opinion their maintenance is getting far too expensive (although I have no complaints about the support).  Unless their prices drop significantly next year I think we are unlikely to renew.  Surely it makes more sense to have a large subscriber base paying a lower contract price than a small privileged group who can afford the high costs.  Hopefully if as a user community we raise our concerns then they will listen.
> > Simon
> > P.S. I only have positive things to say about SVI/Huygens
> >
> > ----------------
> > Imaging Facility
> > Babraham Research Campus
> > [hidden email]
> > http://www.babraham.ac.uk/science-services/imaging
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Seitz Arne [mailto:[hidden email]]
> > Sent: 18 November 2014 14:28
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: Re: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance
> >
> > *****
> > To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> > http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> > Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> > *****
> >
> > In the facility we do have Imaris and Huygens. Until last year both were under a maintenance contract. But for this year I decided against an Imaris contract because I'm really upset with their price policy. The maintenance is way too expensive especially for that what you get in return (IMHO: just nothing). To give you an idea: the maintenance contact for 2014 was promoted with the idea of using Imaris8 from fall that year. Until now Imaris8 has not been launched yet-Bitplane just announced that it will be released soon. So to my opinion is it worth while checking what is offered and what you get.
> > I should point that we still do use Imaris. It is still functioning without maintenance contract (and probably will for a few more years). With the money I save, I will buy/upgrade a software for 3D rendering and analysis when it is necessary (e.g. Arivis might become a real alternative soon).
> >
> > I'm very happy with our Huygens maintenance contract as I do things moving and the price is reasonable.
> >
> > Best regards
> > Arne
> >
> > --no commercial interests--
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
> > Dr. Arne Seitz
> > Head of Bioimaging and Optics Platform (BIOP) Swiss Institute of Technology (EPFL) Faculty of Life Sciences Station 15
> > CH-1015 Lausanne
> >
> > Phone: [phone]
> > Fax:      [phone]
> > http://biop.epfl.ch/
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dale Moulding
> > Sent: mardi 18 novembre 2014 13:35
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: Imaris & Huygens price for maintenance
> >
> > *****
> > To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> > http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> > Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> > *****
> >
> > I've just started looking after our imaging facility. We have Imaris and Huygens software. Is it necessary to get the maintenance for these? They are extortionate! £4312 (yes that is British Pounds) for Imaris bitplane, and a much more palatable £880 for Huygens.
> > Also, what is a good price for the individual huygens packages? I've been quoted £1000 for a small server license, to move the software from a desktop to a workstation (and use all 8 processor cores).
> > I run huygens a lot and am happy to let that lapse, but am not yet familiar with Imaris.
> > thanks all,
> > Dale
> > The Babraham Institute, Babraham Research Campus, Cambridge CB22 3AT Registered Charity No. 1053902.
> > The information transmitted in this email is directed only to the addressee. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete this email from your system. The contents of this e-mail are the views of the sender and do not necessarily represent the views of the Babraham Institute. Full conditions at: www.babraham.ac.uk<http://www.babraham.ac.uk/terms>

     

[Vitaly Boyko]

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Imaris is good. Do not forget it can talk to Fiji, Python and Matlab

     On Thursday, November 20, 2014 7:07 AM, Dale Moulding <[hidden email]> wrote:
   

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Thanks for all the responses, the general feeling seems to be that Imaris is a bit too
expensive, and support isn't as good as it should be. Fortunately our current license is good
for another month, so I'll upgrade to version 8 then let the maintenance lapse. I could of
course just get maintenance for the most heavily used modules, which would be
considerable cheaper, but the consensus does seem to be that the support you get isn't
worth it. What a shame as my initial impression using the software is that it's a very useful
tool.
thanks again,
Dale

   

[Sergey Tauger]

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Huygens too, but we need a bit Tcl background to install and make work
corresponding Tcl-to-smth interface.

I'd like to thank Huygens team, too. First of all, it is the most accurate between
easy to use deconvolution software I tested. Next, their support is perfect.
Even I never purchased Huygens, my questions on deconvolution and the way
Huygens handle it were always answered, both during trial period and after it
finished.

Sergey

[Dieter Goehlmann]

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Dear Avi,

I was a little surprised about your post concerning the lack of Imaris support.

It seems I was the last supporter in contact with you in March 2014. That
ticket Call#54955 was concerning the installation of Imaris on a new machine
so I guess this was about the time when you had problems with the
installation on the Matlab Runtime MCR (created and supported by MathWorks).
The Distributor of Imaris in Israel informed me that you had a problem with
the installation (no additional detailed info was given) and that you needed
some help because you just took over the responsibility for managing the
Imaris set up at your facility. About half an hour later I send you an email
asking to let me know what the problem was so I could help. The next day you
replied that the installation went smoothly and you now knew whom to ask
next time you would need help with Imaris. According to these records it
looks like the response time of Bitplane support was good. From your last
feedback we received it seems you were fully satisfied with our support and
there was no hint of a problem.

After a careful review I could not locate any message from you regarding
problems with the MCR so this is the reason why we could not help you there.
Therefore for us it is important to know what went wrong in this case.
Please let us know how and when you tried to reach us (regarding the MCR
issue) and what contact channel you used. Thank you for your help.

You can contact support by the form on the support page on the website
(http://www.bitplane.com/contact), by email to [hidden email] or by
the European support hotline number [phone]

Best regards,

Dieter

[Avi Jacob]

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Dear Dieter,

First, I will say that indeed when I took over the facility and wanted to
make come changes with the installations, I contacted Newtech, the local
Imaris rep, and the service from them was was excellent and fast, and
within a short time we were up an running again. This means that behind
them, the service from Bitplane must have been good.
I do see we had an email exchange on March 25th just before I finalized the
installation, where I did say that now I know whom to approach.

To be honest, I forgot about this when I had the MCR issue at the end of
September, thus it did not occur to me to ask you directly,  and I do
apologize for that. That said, I scoured the Bitplane site for an answer to
my problem and I am pretty sure I sent in a ticket through the site. (Now I
am second guessing myself about that too).  Hence my "I got no help from
Bitplane"  - after getting no answer. I was pretty frustrated by the
problem, and eventually one of my colleagues solved it for me. (Turns out
that for some reason our Imaris (V.7.x) only recognizes an old MCR version,
not to be found on the Matlab site anymore).

I will say, that sometimes we forget, in this case I forgot, that behind
the corporations are people whom care and do a good job. So I publicly
apologize for not making a better effort to contact you - had I done so I
probably would have said that in this case too, the service was good.

I still stand by my issue with the prices, but that is really not your
fault. But again, I am glad you reminded me about my previous good
experience and I will certainly remember now whom to turn to next time I
have a problem.

Best,
Avi






On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 6:49 PM, Dieter Goehlmann <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Dear Avi,
>
> I was a little surprised about your post concerning the lack of Imaris
> support.
>
> It seems I was the last supporter in contact with you in March 2014. That
> ticket Call#54955 was concerning the installation of Imaris on a new
> machine
> so I guess this was about the time when you had problems with the
> installation on the Matlab Runtime MCR (created and supported by
> MathWorks).
> The Distributor of Imaris in Israel informed me that you had a problem with
> the installation (no additional detailed info was given) and that you
> needed
> some help because you just took over the responsibility for managing the
> Imaris set up at your facility. About half an hour later I send you an
> email
> asking to let me know what the problem was so I could help. The next day
> you
> replied that the installation went smoothly and you now knew whom to ask
> next time you would need help with Imaris. According to these records it
> looks like the response time of Bitplane support was good. From your last
> feedback we received it seems you were fully satisfied with our support and
> there was no hint of a problem.
>
> After a careful review I could not locate any message from you regarding
> problems with the MCR so this is the reason why we could not help you
> there.
> Therefore for us it is important to know what went wrong in this case.
> Please let us know how and when you tried to reach us (regarding the MCR
> issue) and what contact channel you used. Thank you for your help.
>
> You can contact support by the form on the support page on the website
> (http://www.bitplane.com/contact), by email to [hidden email] or
> by
> the European support hotline number [phone]
>
> Best regards,
>
> Dieter
>

[Delisa Garcia]

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Hello Dale,

When the Imaris license at your facility was purchased I provided the
imaging facility manager (not yourself at that time) extremely good
conditions that helped the unit acquire the Imaris “Single Full” (includes
all modules / tools we make). At the same time I also provided the
corresponding maintenance information to the facility manager. The cost of
maintenance is directly linked to the scale and number of licenses the
facility has. I want to make sure you only have the modules you actually
need to support your facility users. I would be happy to talk with you about
how to adjust (if needed) the license configuration to best fit the current
application requirements – adjusting the license configuration down would
bring the cost of maintenance proportionally down.

All the Best

Dr. Delisa Garcia
Scientific Liaison and Regional Sales Engineer
UK, Ireland, Spain, Portugal