Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training

[Scott Page]

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Hi All,
This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.

Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).

What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?

Thanks,
Scott

[Cammer, Michael]

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Occasionally the microscope vendors will provide training even months or years after the initial installation.  This can be extremely valuable.  Core staff sometimes sit in on this training. In addition, core staff always step in to enforce training of core policies.


Initial training is always provided by core staff or vendor technical staff.  Never a third party.


Following initial training, we do encourage people in labs to also do training with their lab members to ensure continuity of lab protocols.  However, even with this, we have encountered cases of incorrect misinformation being propagated.


Cheers-


Michael Cammer, Sr Research Scientist, DART Microscopy Laboratory

NYU Langone Health, 540 First Avenue, SK2 Microscopy Suite, New York, NY  10016

[hidden email]<mailto:[hidden email]>  http://nyulmc.org/micros  http://microscopynotes.com/

Voice direct only, no text or messages:  1-914-309-3270 and 1-646-501-0567



________________________________
From: Confocal Microscopy List <[hidden email]> on behalf of Scott Page <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2019 6:44:30 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training

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Post images on https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.imgur.com&d=DwIFaQ&c=j5oPpO0eBH1iio48DtsedeElZfc04rx3ExJHeIIZuCs&r=hUBj2D5n6oKThx2L01qn8IORZb5f-ruLVXPmQ1zQNnM&m=FUGG5R-A7Chf5d00wyETYE_swTavafEHXPV8r_6dyR8&s=OHyh-o1_1npxDDeziRFVd-JZGUc644W-iirG4S9Lleg&e=  and include the link in your posting.
*****

Hi All,
This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.

Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).

What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?

Thanks,
Scott

[0000001ed7f52e4a-dmarc-request]

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I would say this happens all the time when one more experienced researcher sits at the microscope with one who is  less experienced and I would encourage this. 
But we always insist on all users having formal training by facility staff and access to the microscope on the booking system is only given after this formal training. 
As demand for trainings is very seasonal, I thought about getting temporal staff to help with this, but generally you want the most experienced person to do the job. We deal with a large range of samples and part of the training is to find the right conditions to image them, not sure if an outside person can do this. 
Best wishes
Andreas


-----Original Message-----
From: Cammer, Michael <[hidden email]>
To: CONFOCALMICROSCOPY <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tue, Sep 17, 2019 03:52 AM
Subject: Re: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training


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*****

Occasionally the microscope vendors will provide training even months or years after the initial installation.  This can be extremely valuable.  Core staff sometimes sit in on this training. In addition, core staff always step in to enforce training of core policies.


Initial training is always provided by core staff or vendor technical staff.  Never a third party.


Following initial training, we do encourage people in labs to also do training with their lab members to ensure continuity of lab protocols.  However, even with this, we have encountered cases of incorrect misinformation being propagated.


Cheers-


Michael Cammer, Sr Research Scientist, DART Microscopy Laboratory

NYU Langone Health, 540 First Avenue, SK2 Microscopy Suite, New York, NY  10016

[hidden email]<mailto:[hidden email]>  http://nyulmc.org/micros  http://microscopynotes.com/

Voice direct only, no text or messages:  1-914-309-3270 and 1-646-501-0567



________________________________
From: Confocal Microscopy List <[hidden email]> on behalf of Scott Page <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2019 6:44:30 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training

*****
To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.umn.edu_cgi-2Dbin_wa-3FA0-3Dconfocalmicroscopy&d=DwIFaQ&c=j5oPpO0eBH1iio48DtsedeElZfc04rx3ExJHeIIZuCs&r=hUBj2D5n6oKThx2L01qn8IORZb5f-ruLVXPmQ1zQNnM&m=FUGG5R-A7Chf5d00wyETYE_swTavafEHXPV8r_6dyR8&s=PhELhSpuw-HsEyBFxb-UGMlJXynOhQ5CWUn7_fRAU24&e=
Post images on https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.imgur.com&d=DwIFaQ&c=j5oPpO0eBH1iio48DtsedeElZfc04rx3ExJHeIIZuCs&r=hUBj2D5n6oKThx2L01qn8IORZb5f-ruLVXPmQ1zQNnM&m=FUGG5R-A7Chf5d00wyETYE_swTavafEHXPV8r_6dyR8&s=OHyh-o1_1npxDDeziRFVd-JZGUc644W-iirG4S9Lleg&e=  and include the link in your posting.
*****

Hi All,
This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.

Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).

What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?

Thanks,
Scott

[Sylvie Le Guyader]

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Hi Scott

Our Nikon training is often being outsourced for people who will use Nikon microscopes elsewhere.

This can be for several reasons.
One is of course that the microscope belongs to a lab or a department and that the person in charge is the type that is often replaced (e.g. a postdoc).
One is that the staff feels that they do not have enough expertise for one particular machine (for example the staff has been changed recently and they are already very busy learning about the rest of the equipment) or one particular technique (polarization microscopy or TIRF).
It can also be that the facility is understaffed and that the manager cannot cope with the load. In that case it is simply cheaper to send the users to be trained to a place they trust than to hire someone else. Call it a not so long term management choice.

On the other hand I never hesitate to outsource myself when I do not feel confident and feel that it is best for the users. For example we got a light sheet microscope from M Squared lasers this year. The learning curve for clearing is steep and we are climbing fast but in the meantime, I do not want our users to get a lower service than they should. Recently at the ELMI, I heard Gopi Shah mention that her facility (https://www.embl.es/services/mesoscopic-imaging-facility/members_static/) does custom clearing protocols. We are currently discussing with them but if things work well, I hope to give this tip to our users so they can pay for that external service. In the meantime I will discuss with them and hear all the good tips so we can climb the hill even faster! :D

Med vänlig hälsning / Best regards

Sylvie

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
Sylvie Le Guyader, PhD
Live Cell Imaging Facility Manager
Karolinska Institutet- Bionut Dpt
Hälsovägen 7C,
Room 7362 (lab)/7840 (office)
14157 Huddinge, Sweden
mobile: [phone]
LCI website
Follow our microscopy blog!

-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Scott Page
Sent: 17 September 2019 00:45
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training

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*****

Hi All,
This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.

Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).

What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?

Thanks,
Scott


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[Jacqueline Ross]

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Hi Scott,

We have a policy that only our core facility staff members are allowed to train people on our equipment, even for the most basic microscope we have. This is to make sure that every person using the systems has a good level of training and can acquire high quality data. We also train people individually.

One of the other reasons is care of the instruments. This way, we build a relationship with every user and hopefully they understand the importance of respecting the kit they are  using and the value of it (without scaring them too much). This means that any issues are reported to us including any accidental damage, which by the way, is very rare and I think is a tribute to the training they receive from our staff.

I sometimes assist people with their own research microscopes, which are located outside our facility and I find that there's generally quite a low level of expertise as it has been handed down by other group members and important things are lost along the way. For example, there are two microscopes in research labs here that are very good quality but where users frequently apply oil to air objective lenses. I help out by cleaning the lenses!

I wouldn't recommend outsourcing this. I can't see any positives except that it would be cheaper for the institution as they don't have to pay dedicated staff. Investment in staff who will continue to develop their knowledge and expertise is invaluable in improving research outputs in my opinion.

Cheers,

Jacqui



Jacqueline Ross
Biomedical Imaging Microscopist
Biomedical Imaging Research Unit (BIRU)
School of Medical Sciences
Faculty of Medical & Health Sciences
The University of Auckland
Private Bag 92019
Auckland 1142, NEW ZEALAND

Telephone: Ext 87438; DDI:  [phone]

Website:    http://www.auckland.ac.nz/biru

-----Original Message-----
From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Scott Page
Sent: Tuesday, 17 September 2019 10:45 a.m.
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training

*****
To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
*****

Hi All,
This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.

Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).

What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?

Thanks,
Scott

[Nuno Moreno]

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Completely agree!

\N

> On 17 Sep 2019, at 23:01, Jacqueline Ross <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> We have a policy that only our core facility staff members are allowed to train people on our equipment, even for the most basic microscope we have. This is to make sure that every person using the systems has a good level of training and can acquire high quality data. We also train people individually.
>
> One of the other reasons is care of the instruments. This way, we build a relationship with every user and hopefully they understand the importance of respecting the kit they are  using and the value of it (without scaring them too much). This means that any issues are reported to us including any accidental damage, which by the way, is very rare and I think is a tribute to the training they receive from our staff.
>
> I sometimes assist people with their own research microscopes, which are located outside our facility and I find that there's generally quite a low level of expertise as it has been handed down by other group members and important things are lost along the way. For example, there are two microscopes in research labs here that are very good quality but where users frequently apply oil to air objective lenses. I help out by cleaning the lenses!
>
> I wouldn't recommend outsourcing this. I can't see any positives except that it would be cheaper for the institution as they don't have to pay dedicated staff. Investment in staff who will continue to develop their knowledge and expertise is invaluable in improving research outputs in my opinion.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jacqui
>
>
>
> Jacqueline Ross
> Biomedical Imaging Microscopist
> Biomedical Imaging Research Unit (BIRU)
> School of Medical Sciences
> Faculty of Medical & Health Sciences
> The University of Auckland
> Private Bag 92019
> Auckland 1142, NEW ZEALAND
>
> Telephone: Ext 87438; DDI:  [phone]
>
> Website:    http://www.auckland.ac.nz/biru
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Confocal Microscopy List [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Scott Page
> Sent: Tuesday, 17 September 2019 10:45 a.m.
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Outsourcing Microscopy Facility Training
>
> *****
> To join, leave or search the confocal microscopy listserv, go to:
> http://lists.umn.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A0=confocalmicroscopy
> Post images on http://www.imgur.com and include the link in your posting.
> *****
>
> Hi All,
> This one is for microscopy facility managers and staff in university or academic research institutes.
>
> Does anyone know of examples where a microscopy facility's staff does not provide training on the facility's microscopes to microscope users but rather brings in other employees of the same university or institute who are not facility staff and do not report to the microscope facility manager?  In other words, locally outsourcing the provision of training (this does not include training by microscope company personnel, workshops, conferences, invited speakers, visiting scientists or private training companies).
>
> What does the community see as the positives or negatives of this type of arrangement?
>
> Thanks,
> Scott